Round 9 Fixture

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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by whispy on Sun May 22, 2016 12:08 pm

Lee Harradine wrote:Good to see healthy debate.

Nobody here predicted our current situation before the season started, as far as I recall, so we can all be experts in hindsight, but football life isn't straightforward.

First, how can you plan for two forwards going from kicking 80 goals to only a few? Who predicted that?

Who predicted that a host of players would be so down on form?

Who predicted that each of the finals players who didn't play in the GF would miss most of the season - Homburg, Anderson, Brind and Agostino with a late start?

Recruiting: start with a full salary cap, lose several promising players on low salaries, accommodate premiership players seeking higher salaries, lose two key players very late to the rookie draft.

That leaves room for only a couple of recruits at best. We recruited Trent Stubbs, who looks a good player and Zac O'Brien, who we're now seeing play good footy.

Did we try to recruit key position players? Of course, that was our major target. We were close to several, but just missed out and had 2 likely targets drafted.

Did other clubs needing key position players succeed in getting them? Not much, if at all.

(Continued)......

Fair post Lee...this is not criticism, just questions... but where you posted players seeking higher wages, perhaps members would like to know how many players demanded a higher wage after winning a grand final?
Why could not the club put in place a bonus system for example $1,000 per player for winning the Grand Final?
Could we have lost players if their demands were not met? A bit of blackmail going on there?.  Were their wages lower than at other clubs last year? If so, i can understand an increase in payments.

Just thinking. Very Happy
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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by blackandred on Sun May 22, 2016 12:16 pm

.....and is there any crossover between those players who demanded more money after the premiership and those players now so hopelessly out of form?

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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by TAAARS on Sun May 22, 2016 2:34 pm

Many on here (all passionate bloods supporters ) are alarmed at how we have gone from champs to chumps in 8 games. I among them am stunned at the change in attitude  of the playing group. As I have said before it is though they don't want to be out there,been there done that and so on. In my opinion the problem lays with the players pure and simple. Some will blame the coaches etc but it can't be them as they have proven themselves last year. Some will blame the board but can't be them as they have no influence on field and they also are the same as last year.
It is in my view between the ears or a "mental attitude" of the players as Lee said in a previous post,where the problem lays.
As an example that springs to mind. At the Grand Final night celebration at Richmond oval when the players were presented with the cup on the outside deck of the past players rooms when it was Kaine Stevens turn he said "back to back next year"or words to that effect. Not one other player said yeah! or anything to indicate they are keen to repeat the effort. I remember thinking at the time odd there was not more enthusiasm to go again. Is it any coincidence that Kaine is our best player to date this year (in my view) and one of the few that stands up each week?
This phenomenon is quite common in some clubs ie Freo,St Kilda,Bulldogs and us if you look in to our history. Every time we have a good year and make the GF let a lone win one we fall away??? I have no cure but we need to find one,somehow and soon. Perhaps a phsyco on staff or an old fashioned rocket up them,who knows.
What I do know is it is becoming unbearable to watch.
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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by Lee Harradine on Sun May 22, 2016 2:41 pm

Fair questions, b&r, and I don't take questions as criticism.

You'll understand I can't go into detail about players' salaries, that's confidential, but I'm happy to answer in general.

First, dealing with players was fair and reasonable and no pressure was involved, certainly no 'blackmail' whatsoever. You'll be pleased to know that all players just wanted to stay and salary dealings were amicable.

More to the point is that, for example, a player might have signed 2 years before on a minimum contract and in that 2 years became a key player. In that case, his value has to be recognised.

That's normal and fair.

As for incentives, in practice it doesn't work, as you'd then need to budget for them to be paid, regardless of result.

Our CEO is highly experienced in managing a salary cap and having seen how he operates, I have full confidence it couldn't be done any better.

Whatever the cause of our current problems, salary consideration isn't one of them.

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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by MR BLOODHOUND on Sun May 22, 2016 8:42 pm

Having followed Westies for over the past 60 years I will continue to go as I have through the good and bad years but I am concerned that our form will deter the new supporters or returning ones who we gained at the end of last year will be lost because of this poor showing.
I believe the season can be turned around and we will be able to get something positive out of the rest of the season.
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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by aldo russian on Sun May 22, 2016 9:08 pm

I expected us to be top 3 and challenging for the flag again this year. We lost 3 regular League players in Keough, Beech and Snelling, the others played very little senior footy. To offset that we had Webb available after missing most of the year, a much fitter Hardy (who has pretty much covered Keough's loss) and well credentialled recruits in Stubbs and O'Brien.

The injuries to players like Helbig, Anderson, Homburg, Hartlett and Brind (and latterly Porps) though have compounded the loss of the other fringe/young players, but it should also be said that 5 injured players is neither excessive nor to be unexpected.

The real concern is that we don't seem to know how to turn these performances around. The excuse of players being underdone doesn't hold now, when we're half way through the season. And we're still starting games horribly, just as we did for most of last year. Why haven't we got any better at that?

I think the fact that there doesn't appear to be one clear explanation for what's happened is the reason we need an internal inquiry/review into this shemozzle.

At half time on Friday night, against the 2nd bottom side missing their 2 best midfielders, 13 of our players had between them amassed a total of 26 kicks. That's two thirds of the side. How do you explain that?
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Re: Round 9 Fixture

Post by Mark Beswick on Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:22 pm

The bonus payment cant work as it counts as salary cap its an idea that would work only if players wages are cut totalling 21K of avout a 400K total to cover a premiership win.
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